Dismantling The Stigma
Dismantling The Stigma

SMART Recovery® Podcast

Jen Jones and Lindsay Moore share how their experiences of liver failure and alcohol use disorder led to the creation of Sober Livers, a peer-based support organisation. The conversation focuses on agency, stigma, practical support groups, and the push for lived experience to shape liver transplant decisions.

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39:05•21 Oct 2026

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Agency, Stoicism and Sober Livers: Challenging Stigma Around Alcohol and Liver Disease

Episode Overview

Sober Livers was created to give people facing both alcohol use disorder and liver disease a sense of agency and a non-judgemental community.
Jen Jones’ experience of severe alcohol-associated hepatitis and feeling alone in hospital led her to build programmes centred on connection and support.
Lindsay Moore describes liver failure at 31, hospice care, and a turning point grounded in wanting to be present for her best friend, then using education to strengthen her recovery.
Sober Livers offers national online groups, education sessions with clinicians, a buddy system, and verification forms that can support liver transplant evaluations.
The organisation supports multiple recovery approaches but strongly promotes abstinence for people with liver disease, while pushing for lived experience to be included in transplant decision teams.

“We want to give them the agency they deserve.”

What drives someone to seek a life without alcohol? This episode of the SMART Recovery Podcast follows that question through the stories behind Sober Livers, a nonprofit focused on people living with both Alcohol Use Disorder and alcohol-associated liver disease. You'll hear how founder Jen Jones went from government contracting and NASA grants to starting Sober Livers after her own liver failure and a 30% chance of survival.

Her experience of feeling completely alone in hospital led her to create a space where, as she puts it, "people could understand no matter their journey, they have a place" and "we want to give them the agency they deserve." Stoicism, Amor Fati, and the idea that "well-being is realised with small steps" sit at the heart of her outlook.

Programme coordinator Lindsay Moore shares a starkly different yet equally powerful path: liver failure at 31, being sent home on hospice, using alcohol as passive suicide, then deciding to live so she could show up for her best friend. She talks about relearning to walk, getting qualified in addiction and intervention studies, and now running groups that mix goal-setting with frank chat and Friday-night humour.

The episode lays out Sober Livers’ support structure: national online groups, an education series with clinicians, age-specific meetings, pet-focused sessions, a buddy system, and verification forms that can support transplant evaluations. Jen and Lindsay emphasise being recovery-pathway agnostic while still stressing abstinence for people with liver disease, and they highlight the huge gap in liver organisations offering programmes for alcohol-associated liver disease.

Lindsay’s long-term mission is to get people with lived experience into transplant decision-making teams, challenging stigma baked into the idea of "insight" in active addiction. If you or someone you care about is facing alcohol issues alongside liver problems, could hearing from people who have been there help you feel a bit less alone?

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