The pleasure of painThe pleasure of pain
All In The Mind
Spicy food, scary movies, BDSM … why do humans sometimes chase painful experiences and how are they linked to pleasure?
29:06•5 Mar 2022
Why We Chase Pain: Paul Bloom on Pleasure, Effort and Meaning
Episode Overview
- Humans often seek controlled pain, such as spicy food or scary films, because contrast makes the following pleasure more intense.
- There is a crucial difference between chosen suffering, which can feel rewarding, and unchosen suffering, which remains purely harmful.
- Effortful activities like puzzles, exercise or climbing mountains can feel satisfying due to mastery, value and the process itself.
- Flow states arise in tasks that are challenging but doable, offering immersion and temporary relief from everyday worries.
- Trying hard to be happy tends to backfire; focusing on meaningful, absorbing activities and allowing happiness to follow is more effective.
“Chosen suffering has all of these benefits and these possibilities. Unchosen suffering, the involuntary experience of pain or humiliation or anguish is as bad as everybody thinks it's bad.”
What drives someone to seek out things that hurt a bit and yet somehow feel good? This episode of *All In The Mind* sits with that puzzle as psychologist Professor Paul Bloom unpacks why humans lean into discomfort, from chilli-laden curries to marathon training and BDSM.
You’ll hear Bloom explain "benign masochism" – those moments where we deliberately dose ourselves with controlled pain to boost pleasure, like poking a sore tooth or sitting in an almost-too-hot bath because the cool-down feels blissful. He points out that contrast matters: pain first, pleasure after.
As he jokes via his dad’s old line, the man banging his head against the wall says, "It feels so good when I stop." Bloom also draws a sharp line between chosen and unchosen suffering: "Chosen suffering has all of these benefits and these possibilities. Unchosen suffering… is as bad as everybody thinks it's bad." Control, he argues, is the "secret sauce" that turns hardship into something satisfying rather than traumatic.
Host Sana Kadar guides the conversation through effort and flow states too – why people tackle Wordle, weightlifting, mountain climbing or Brazilian jiu-jitsu even though they demand serious exertion. Bloom shares his own first jiu-jitsu session, noticing that while being tossed around the mat, he thought of nothing else; the pain and focus briefly erased his everyday worries. The episode then stretches into bigger life choices: parenting, careers, and the tension between pleasure and meaning.
Studies show parents can be more exhausted and not necessarily happier, yet they report greater meaning. Bloom suggests we’re "motivational pluralists" who want happiness, morality and purpose, and sometimes choose difficult paths – like having children or doing demanding work – because they give our lives weight. He leaves listeners with two practical ideas: stop trying so hard to be happy, and seek out challenging, absorbing activities that create flow.
It’s a handy reminder to ask yourself: where might a little bit of chosen struggle make your life feel richer?
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