The psychopath withinThe psychopath within
All In The Mind
The intriguing story of the neuroscientist with the brain scan of a psychopathic killer, and can we stop 'callous and unemotional' kids from becoming adult psychopaths?
29:20•4 May 2014
The Psychopath Within: Brains, Childhood and the Thin Line of Empathy
Episode Overview
- James Fallon describes having both genetic and brain-scan markers linked to psychopathy, yet growing up without becoming violent, suggesting a powerful protective role for a warm childhood.
- He distinguishes between criminal psychopaths and people like himself who show traits such as manipulation, superficial charm and lack of emotional empathy, but function in everyday society.
- The phrase "Genetics load the gun, but the environment pulls the trigger" captures how certain risk genes magnify the impact of early abuse or care.
- Mark Dadds outlines how children who are callous and unemotional respond less to punishment and guilt, and may need parenting approaches that rebuild warmth and emotional connection.
- Repeated, brief moments of mutual eye contact and shared positive attention between parents and children are being tested as a way to rekindle love, possibly reshaping emotional development.
“"Genetics load the gun, but the environment pulls the trigger."”
What remarkable journeys have people faced head-on against psychopathy? This episode of *All In The Mind* takes a sharp, sometimes darkly funny look at the science and lived experience behind that loaded word. Neuroscientist James Fallon shares how he stumbled across a brain scan that looked like a "pure form of the murderer" – and then realised it was his own.
With a family tree peppered with killers and a host of genes "associated with violence, aggression, low anxiety, low emotional empathy", he jokes about being a "borderline pro-social psychopath" who can be a real jerk, yet has never been violent. His stories – like taking his brother into a cave tied to deadly viruses without warning him – show how charm, manipulation and emotional flatness can play out in everyday life.
At the same time, Fallon reflects on how a loving upbringing might have protected him from becoming dangerous, summing it up with the line, "Genetics load the gun, but the environment pulls the trigger." He even experiments on himself, slowing down his behaviour to act less selfishly with his wife and family, admitting, "You understand it's not sincere" – and hearing back that changed actions are still worth something.
Clinical child psychologist Mark Dadds then shifts the focus to children described as "callous and unemotional" – kids who are aggressive, lack guilt, and "just don't care" when they hurt others. He explains how standard parenting programs help, but less so for these kids, and outlines his research into rebuilding warmth, especially through repeated, short bursts of eye contact and shared positive moments. Early results suggest that repairing this deep connection may change how these children relate to others.
If you're curious about how genes, childhood, empathy and behaviour fit together – or you're a parent, clinician or just someone who wonders what makes a "psychopathic" brain tick – this conversation will give you plenty to think about. Where do you see the line between who you are wired to be and how you're raised?
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