#796 A Deep Dark Dive with Jenny Lawson
#796 A Deep Dark Dive with Jenny Lawson

Mental Illness Happy Hour

Paul Gilmartin and Jenny Lawson talk candidly about severe depression, suicidal thoughts, anxiety, self‑harm urges and creative life, mixing dark humour with practical coping tools. The conversation also touches on parenting a queer, non‑binary child and how small acts of honesty can quietly keep people alive.

HonestInspiringAuthenticSupportiveHealing

1:51:22•17 Apr 2026

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Jenny Lawson on Dark Humour, Suicidal Thoughts and Finding Your Weird People

Episode Overview

Honest sharing of depression, anxiety and suicidal ideation can reduce shame and help others step towards support.
Compulsive behaviours like hair-pulling and skin-picking are real conditions, not character flaws, and can be managed with practical substitutions and self‑care tricks.
Crisis lines are worth preparing for in advance and can be used both for yourself and when you’re supporting someone else.
Medication, ketamine, TMS and other treatments often involve long trial-and-error, and “good enough” relief can be a valid goal.
Letting trusted people know you’re struggling is a gift to them as well as to you, and small, non‑perfect attempts at support and correct pronouns still matter.

“"I was actively in the process of planning my suicide and decided not to, not because of what I had written, but because they saw a thousand comments of people saying, ‘me too.’"”

What can we learn from those who have battled addiction to their own thoughts, bodies and brains? This long, raw conversation between host Paul Gilmartin and writer Jenny Lawson lays it all out with gallows humour and zero gloss. Jenny – a five-time New York Times bestselling author – talks frankly about treatment‑resistant depression, relentless suicidal ideation, anxiety, social terror, trichotillomania and dermatillomania.

She explains how she once felt like the “only one”, hiding in a toy box as a child and later hiding behind funny blog posts as an adult, until honesty online revealed thousands of people quietly whispering “me too”.

You’ll hear how simple acts of openness have literally changed lives, including a reader who wrote, “I’m still here because you reminded me that I’m not alone.” Paul and Jenny swap stories about overthinking, catastrophic fears, cancer, medication trials, ketamine, TMS and the exhausting science experiment of finding what keeps them just above the most dangerous lows.

Jenny shares practical tricks for managing self‑harm urges – from cutting nails short to swapping skin‑picking for sheet masks and ice cubes – and talks about learning to ask for help without drowning loved ones. There’s also space for parents of queer and non‑binary kids, as she reflects on supporting her child Haley in a hostile political climate and learning to get pronouns right, messily but lovingly. Despite the heavy themes, the chat is oddly comforting.

The jokes are dark, the stories are strange, and yet the message is simple: you’re probably doing better than you think, and you’re definitely less alone than your brain insists. If you’ve ever felt broken, too much, or secretly suicidal while still functioning, this might be the conversation that makes you feel seen – what small step could you take today to feel a little less alone?

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